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hi everybody I want to tell you about

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objective and phenomenological methods

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in consciousness studies with reference

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to spirit mediumship in natural sciences

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especially but also in in all of

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mainstream normal science we expect a

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lot of objective methodology and in fact

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at this conference we've seen a lot of

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great examples of it from people like

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Dean Radin for example controlled

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laboratory experimental designs we

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sociologists and anthropologists use a

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lot of phenomenological methods in

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participant observation and an

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ethnographic interviewing where we're

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trying to get people to talk about their

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views of the world if we want an example

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in parapsychology we could look at

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pamela rae Heath's article in 2000 in

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journal of parapsychology the PK zone a

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phenomenological study where she has

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people talk about their mental states

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during their psychokinetic experiences

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one of the great advantages of objective

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methodology of course is for uncovering

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mundane explanations and trying to

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eliminate those explanations to see if

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we really have an anomaly that needs to

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be explained for example Gary Schwartz

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in the afterlife experiments 2002

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developed increasingly stricter

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protocols for testing spirit mediums

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performance in a laboratory setting and

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contrasting them to a control group of

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guessers we've got a lot of good

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objective data such as this in the areas

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of spirit mediumship end e's apparitions

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or ghosts and reincarnation but there's

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still a debate as to whether we've got

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evidence for survival of consciousness

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after bodily death rather than merely

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some kind of sigh among the living

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psychic abilities among the living this

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is very interesting debate we're stuck

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for a specific mechanism that would

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explain either house I or survival would

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work maybe the mechanisms are the same

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that we would still like to know the

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source of the information from

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sigh with a living person as opposed to

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sigh from a spirit let's say there are

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interesting theories of hidden orders

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that are consistent with the data look

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at Dean Radin for example entangled

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minds 2006 and talking about non local

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connections and quantum physics okay

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here's an idea why don't we just get rid

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of all the objective methods and go to

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the phenomenological methods let's just

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ask spirit mediums if they're really

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talking to dead people and that will

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settle it once for all bad idea I teach

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sociological research methods and I am a

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fan of multiple methodologies and point

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out there are always advantages and

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disadvantages of all the methods now

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it's time for me to tell you how I've

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used phenomenological methods and

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studying spirit mediums first of all as

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a sociologist and an anthropologist I

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see this all in terms of sociology of

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knowledge and so the first question is

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why do we even ask this question about

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whether there's survival of spirit in a

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scientific way if you look in

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traditional Chinese culture and you can

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get an example of this from my book

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Chinese ghost and ESP 1982 which has a

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section on spirit mediums the Chinese

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perspective would ordinarily be that you

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take spirit mediumship for granted and

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the question is whether this particular

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spirit medium is bringing through your

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grandfather but in this society science

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is the dominant legitimate way of

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knowing next point is that some people

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in this society put the phenomenological

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personal experience of consciousness

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ahead of the objective scientific

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perspective skip Atwater who was a

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director of research at the monroe

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institute for 20 years told me in a

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recent interview that he has been

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spending a lot of time gathering

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evidence to demonstrate what he knows is

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quote obviously true unquote in other

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words he uses both objective and

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phenomenological approaches for the past

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15 years my wife penelope and i have

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studied spirit mediums in the united

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states this is our book guided by spirit

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journey into the mind of the medium 2003

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it's mostly a phenomenological approach

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as you can tell from the title minds of

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medians asking them to describe their

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own process and surprise most of the 40

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mediums we interviewed and the 82

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mediums whose biographies I analyzed

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have been at least somewhat skeptical of

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the survival hypothesis any this is in

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the Western world right nearly all

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mediums look for confirmations that is

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also mediums often embrace a sigh

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explanation for their readings they'll

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say that was just a psychic reading that

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I did or I read that person's aura

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instead of getting the information from

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the spirit world like I was supposed to

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hear in lilydale now here's a nice

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example of a confirmation that some

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people would say leans toward a survival

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interpretation at least because it seems

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to eliminate telepathy among the living

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the medium told the unknown sitter in a

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telephone reading your deceased Aunt

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Ruth is here yes I had an aunt ruth she

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wants you to have a ruby ring her ruby

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ring it's in a secret compartment at the

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back of the second drawer in her dresser

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which is now in your mother's house

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nobody in the family knew anything about

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this ring but they found it just wear

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the medium said it was going to be and

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called her back the medium was my wife

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Penelope an objective scientist would

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probably object to using Penelope's

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phenomenological report especially since

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she's one of the authors of the book to

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me my knowledge of Penelope increases

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the validity of the account now here's

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another singer by the way singers do not

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happen all the time this case also

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erodes my academic respectability even

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further I appear as a commentator in the

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TV documentary ghosts of Gettysburg

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which has been on national cable TV over

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60 times I know it's been on because I

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get all these emails letters and phone

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calls the next day before that show was

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produced this was in 1995 Penelope took

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her first trip to Gettysburg and to a

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little round top on the Gettysburg

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battlefield on two consecutive days in

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early July on the anterior

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to read the battle now Penelope knew

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little or nothing about the northern

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general Joshua Chamberlain at that time

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but she apparently channeled him onto

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those two days it seemed to be like an

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obsession case rather than possession

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because she could see the battlefield as

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it was now as it is now and as it was

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then and have a conversation with

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Chamberlain in her head there were a lot

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of evidential details such as she said

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he was trying to get a letter to Sarah

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which turned out to be the name of his

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mother and also name of his sister and

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Penelope felt a pain she had difficulty

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walking because of a pain in her left

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hip and her right ankle which we found

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out later were the two places that

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Chamberlain had been injured in the

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battle of Gettysburg now six years later

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in 2001 I got an email from a woman who

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had seen the TV show ghost of Gettysburg

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and she told me that she thought the

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spirit of Joshua Chamberlain was trying

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to enter her body and this happened

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about a hundred yards from where

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Penelope had had her experience and was

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also in early June this is the only

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obsession or possession case I've ever

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gotten from the hundreds of people who

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have contacted me when they want to tell

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me about their ghost experiences in

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Gettysburg and at that time Penelope's

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experience had not been published

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anywhere later on I found out that

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Chamberlain often revisited the

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battlefield on anniversary of the battle

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when he was still alive does he continue

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to visit the battlefield on the

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anniversary of the battle after his

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death that I jelly that other woman had

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that also an early July and what kind of

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explanations you need in order to

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explain this case in terms of super sigh

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now let's take the phenomenological

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approach one step further and demolish

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what little is left of my academic

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reputation at least in sociology if not

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in SSE participatory science

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participatory science involves the

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researcher moving away from objectivity

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at a distance and jumping right into the

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study itself this is like dr. Jekyll

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taking his own potion and turning into

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mr. Hyde bad things happen to you

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in sociology and anthropology

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participant observation approaches

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participatory science but you're not

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supposed to go native I went native i

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became a spirit medium he was supposed

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to study spirit mediums not become one

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but I think this was the best part of my

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part of the study what better way to do

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a phenomenological study then leap whole

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hog into the phenomenon itself I think I

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still have a pretty good dose of

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skepticism anyway because you know I

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really want to know what's going on I

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study this stuff because i have a

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curiosity addiction like everybody else

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in this room and so for me to fool

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myself would be like cheating at

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solitaire you know what's the point you

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know so you know I really do head

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actually the spirit mediums think I'm a

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skeptic actually now as described in

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guided by spirit lo and behold I've had

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zingers to not all the time but lots of

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them from a phenomenological perspective

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I can tell you there is something going